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NATURE CANNOT SURVIVE ALONE ONCE INTERFERRED WITH BY MAN!!!!

 
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Would you like to hear a professionals view on the topic NATURE SHOULD BE LEFT ALONE?
Yes
58%
 58%  [ 14 ]
No
41%
 41%  [ 10 ]
Total Votes : 24

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gibbysgirl
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:20 pm    Post subject: NATURE CANNOT SURVIVE ALONE ONCE INTERFERRED WITH BY MAN!!!! Reply with quote

After reading some of the things people are concerned with on how people should just do nothing I couldn't believe what I was hearing. HELLO!!!

If you honestly believe that nature "takes care of itself" you know nothing about the environment. Once people moved onto the Island they at that point interferred with nature and must do whats right by helping it to form new growth and pump the muck out of the lakes to allow for new life. These inland lakes are going to die. Does the DNR just let nature be. NO they assist in making it more productive by assisting nature to grow and create not only new growth but new wildlife as well. Wake up people, my family has been on this Island for 5 generations and is probably one of the original families to live here. I want to be able to have my grandchildren come here as well. Without our help this Island will be nothing but a lump of dead trees and lakes that are 4-6" deep with not a fish in sight unless we do something to help revitalize this land. You people who are screaming let nature be really need to get in contact with an environmentalist and get some facts about what really happens to uncared parks and nature trails. I say call in an expert. I say lets all chip in and make this place what it was 80 years ago when my grandpa moved here. I vote for new growth and new life.
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Squeaky
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

VERY WELL SAID gibbysgirl. thumbs_up!
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joe
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 3:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't know where you've been Gibbysgirl, but keep on posting. That was one of the most concise and well reasoned posts I've read in a long time. I'm glad we've had a wake up call. Now lets stay awake and actually follow through and do something about caring for and restoring the Island. Welcome!

Cheers,
Joe
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Bruce Lord
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 4:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not saying we shouldn't help nature along, but I am thinking there are much bigger problems with "nature" then on this little island. We need to fix the entire planet at the same time. Globally there are bigger isssues at hand. We need to save the world for our children and grandchildren, not just the island.
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Rich
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everyone needs to take care of their own areas, not the entire planet. If everyone follows that principle the world will be fine. The island is our area.
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theeislandgirl
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2006 9:58 pm    Post subject: planet Reply with quote

Bruce

I agree with you ......


The island is not the place we all live !
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Kevin Gibbons
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So what are you saying we need to solve the world problems insted of working on our own. Maybe it would be better if the part timmers would come to the Island and ask "HOW CAN I HELP" instead of saying what should be done and leaving it for the Islanders to do the work. And then if it isn't to the satisfaction of everyone then the complaints start. If you have an idea make it benifit the Island instead of one person. Everyone needs to help keep up the Island not let it run down. The answer isn't that we have bigger problems some where else.
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Kathy Gibbons
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 8:53 am    Post subject: Nature cannot Survive alone Reply with quote

I have been sitting back and reading the postings regarding the condition of the Island Lakes and Forest. First, I am a little puzzed by the person who doesn't want a professional opinion on this issue. The only reason I can think Surprised of for not considering this option is that maybe they wouldn't like the answer. Most people who live or own property on Boblo, do so because it is truly a special place. There are ways for us to help address the global issues and still work and resolve the problems that lay right at our feet. Because you don't "live" on the island makes you no less reponsible to help maintain it's integerity. I agree that the Forest is in trouble. When I ride around the island I am beginning to see lots of tall trees and at the base of these trees is nothing but dead and fallen trees and no new growth. Lakes so full of muck that the fish have hardly anywhere to live.

But, enough said. Anyone willing to DO SOMETHING instead of talking about it, I'll be the first one to help. I,m sure there are many people who have ideas where to start and who to contact for help in these matters. I know it is a long process and sometimes frustrating but I think we owe it to ourself, our family, and our future generations to come.
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NJean
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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

gibbysgirl - I couldn't have said it better myself. A little common sense goes a long way on this topic. The inland lakes are what really make this island unique and they deserve the necessary attention to keep them this way or should I say the way they were before they had very few and small fish and a lot of silt. From the information and pictures I have seen at the museum, bringing the island back to what it was 80 years ago would be an excellent goal. More fish, more wild game, deeper water and less junk trees.

While we're talking about conservation, I also think the $20,000-$60,000 would be much better spent on island conservation rather than dusty roads. The dust really doesn't bother me and hoses, timers and sprinklers are a pretty cheap fix for these property owners. The twp. could probably have supplied them to all these property owners with the $20,000 already spent. Has anybody checked into the cost of crushed limestone that eventually packs down like cement, therefore, no dust? We did that vs paving our driveway and it's great. Considering the amount of limestone on the island, this should be the least expensive permanent fix for this problem if that is what the islanders want.
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gibbysgirl
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Joined: 07 Aug 2006
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Location: Cheboygan

PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2006 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

WOW!!!

I think some of you are on the wrong website!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I thought this was a website for Bois Blanc Island, concerned individuals who want to make this a better place. If I was concerned about bigger issues elswhere in the world I would address them on their site. I don't doubt that there are too many areas that need attention in our country and in the world for that matter. Let the people that live there take care of there own problems , And for those of you saying "Not everybody lives here" , thats just fine but this website is for Bois Blanc Island so if you have concerns for other areas , post your opinions there. My topic is about this Island which I love and I am trying to see how many people out there really want to make a difference here and make an effort whether it be for an hour or a weekend here and there if we all pull together we can make a difference. IF WE DONT DO SOMETHING THIS ISLAND WILL NOT SURVIVE!!So if you don't want to post an opinion about helping or a legitamate concern regarding "BOIS BLANC"and the problems with our wildlife and natural resources dying and if your not interested in the topic why reply.? The work needs to be done and if we need help Its out there, where there is a will there is a way. There are ways to make this happen and I want to see just what is out there for support from other land owners. Are you ready to make a difference?

The point on the road dust is an excellent point!!!! BRAVO!!! twenty thousand dollars sure would buy a lot of sprinklers. If dust is such an issue to homeowners I am sure many of them would give up some of their power to run a pump and sprinkler. This is how many people reduce dust. The crushed limestone sounds good too. Let's work together ! God helps those who help themselves.

From just the couple of comments I have received there are a lot of people who want to see some changes, who's with me? my email is open for questions or contact.

Thanks for your support

Sheri



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PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2006 8:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Participate! Come and make your opinions heard!

Focus groups concerning review of the

Bois Blanc Master Plan

will be meeting on the following dates at locations listed..
All groups will start at 1pm

Saturday August 19th at Susie Phillips house, east end
Saturday August 19th at Hoover Community Building, Pines

Saturday August 26th at Wybranowski's House, west end
Saturday August 26th at Hoover Community Building, Pines


Here is a chance to have a say! I find a lot of people talk but don't participate.. There is plenty of notice for a lot of you to attend the focus group on the 26th.. I will be at the focus group in the Pines on the 19th.. There was a State of the Island meeting hosted by Loren Gibbons last month that had a small attendance and I had expected to see the room filled after reading the posts here.. If getting your ideas and thoughts to a meeting is a problem you may have to email or write to the township to add your thoughts.. I will try to get that info posted unless someone on here already has it.. I expect the nature of things has very little to do with the master plan as that is State issues but I know a lot of you have opinions on zoning issues....

When it comes to the nature of things; The only thing I've seen changing much in the 30 years I can remember is the amount of houses and roads increasing.. The inland lakes have always been the way they are.. People have messed with them in the past to increase fish and depth with no success.. I disagree that working to improve will help.. Mostly because talk is talk and action doesn't happen because in the long run all the action talked about costs big bucks that no one has or wants to pony up.. How's that for a bottom line...... Very Happy
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Kevin Gibbons
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 14, 2006 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Susie I agree with the zonning meeting the more peoples opions the better. I disagree with you on the lakes there has been no pumping out of the mud and there has been fish planting in 91 or 92 and there is some walleye and blue gill fishing know where there never has been in the past. And the lakes have changed since I was younger there is more marsh areas and more bogs and some in the middle of twin lakes. anyway. And thats not good. The water is down in twins since this spring about 6" which makes the mud looks worse. But they have changed for the worse. There don't seem to be any ducks at all where they used to be full of mallards and flight ducks. I do see a few loons once in a while, not as many as I did years ago. And the pirch and pike are a lot smaller now then they used to be.
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Conis
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have done a little reading so as to get my terms straight. The “muck” in BBIs inland lakes is more like mud, 95% composed of limestone silt. It isn’t “muck” which would be better described as decaying organic matter.

If you study the shoreline you see a few reeds here and there, maybe an occasional school of minnows. What you DO NOT see are emerging lake weeks or duckweed, Lilly pads or other vegetation such as expansive cattail marshes around the shore… all of which require nutrients. Clear water, little or no nutrients to support fish or ducks. Ducks eat lake weeds. Loons eat fish. Lacking nutrients, an oligotrophic lake has the capacity to support only a very limited food chain.

By all definitions, the inland lakes on BBI are oligotrophic. Removing any minimal nutritional sediment (ie muck) from the lakes could make them completely sterile.

A $2.00 water test for nitrates/nitrites/phosphates would most like support this. Because BBI is mostly limestone, I also suspect the water is highly alkaline.

Read about this in detail. Classification of different types of lakes in Michigan. For those looking for a professional "scientific" opinion, this information will provide plenty of insight.

http://www.mlswa.org/lkclassif1.htm

Excerpted from this article:

Quote:
Oligotrophic lakes contain very low concentrations of those nutrients required for plant growth and thus the overall productivity of these lakes is low. Only a small quantity of organic matter grows in an oligotrophic lake; the phytoplankton, the zooplankton, the attached algae, the macrophytes (aquatic weeds), the bacteria, and the fish are all present as small populations. It's like planting corn in sandy soil, not much growth. There may be many species of plankton and many different types of other organisms, but not very many of each species or type. There may be some big fish but not very many of them. With so little production of organic matter, there is very little accumulation of organic sediment on the bottom of oligotrophic lakes…. (edit) Oligotrophic lakes have nice clean water, no weed problems and poor fishing. They are often deep with cold water. They are seldom in populated areas -- too many people and heavy use tends to eventually shift them out of the oligotrophic category. They are seldom in good agricultural areas; rich soils needed for agriculture do not allow nutrient poor drainage water needed for the oligotrophic lake. We find most of our oligotrophic lakes in Michigan in the upper peninsula and in the upper third of our lower peninsula.

Eutrophic lakes are the general contrast to the oligotrophic lakes and lie at the other end of the continuum. They are rich in plant nutrients and thus their productivity is high. They produce high numbers of phytoplankton (suspended algae) which often cloud the water so that we have poor Secchi disk readings (average about 2.5 meters or 8.0 feet). These lakes also produce high numbers of zooplankton and minnows and other small fish that feed on the zooplankton. These small fish in turn provide food for the growth of larger fish. All in all, there is a high production of organic matter, like corn planted in rich soil. Much of this organic matter drifts to the bottom and forms a considerable depth of organic
Sediment.

So the oligotrophic and eutrophic lakes are contrast ends of the eutrophic continuum. But human nature has stepped in, and we find that often we say a lake is really a little beyond oligotrophic or it isn't quite eutrophic. In other words we rationalize (recognize or create) a transition stage between the oligotrophic and the eutrophic classes. After all, as the oligotrophic lake ages, it gradually accumulates nutrients and sediments, and moves toward and eventually into the eutrophic stage. This natural eutrophication process commonly takes thousands of years and involves both the physical filling of the lake and chemical enrichment of the lake water. Cultural eutrophication, which can occur in a human generation or two, involves chemical enrichment of the lake water by human activity in the lake drainage basin. The transition stage between the oligotrophic and eutrophic conditions has been called a mesotrophic lake.
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NJean
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The article below refers to Bois Blanc Island and the protecting of the Hines dragon fly. In the article it refers to "fens" the areas in which these dragon flies live. Apparently if Bois Blanc Island is one of the 4 areas in Michigan to have these dragon flies then the lakes are probably not oligotrophic lakes.

See description of fen @ http://www.epa.gov/owow/wetlands/types/fen.html

By JOHN PEPIN, Journal Munising Bureau and The Associated Press

ST. IGNACE — The federal government is expected to publish a proposed rule in the Federal Register this week that would declare 14,348 acres in Michigan as protected areas or critical habitats for the endangered Hine’s emerald dragonfly.

The Hine’s emerald dragonfly lives in special wetlands called “fens” and it is found in Wisconsin, Illinois, Michigan, Missouri, and Alabama.

The designation would affect proposed development projects with a federal tie. The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service would have to be consulted to make sure the proposed projects would not negatively impact critical habitat areas.

“It only affects federal actions, basically,” said Christie Deloria-Sheffield, a wildlife biologist with the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service in Marquette.

After the proposed rule is issued, a 60-day public comment period will follow, closing Sept. 25.

Overall, the rule would affect land in Wisconsin, Illinois, Michigan and Missouri. Of the 14,348 acres in Michigan included, 12,963 are expected to be withdrawn from the rule because they are areas already protected by the recently revised forest management plan for the Hiawatha National Forest.

The remaining 1,385 acres would include portions of the northern Lower Peninsula and a section of Mackinac County in the Upper Peninsula.

In Michigan, there are currently only four known sites for the dragonfly including Bois Blanc Island in Mackinac County and in three places downstate near Thompson Harbor in Presque Isle County and near Misery Bay in Alpena County.

“There’s other potential sites,” Sheffield said. “Either we haven’t found them at those sites or haven’t surveyed yet.”

In the 1990s, when the dragonfly was first discovered in Michigan, some survey work was done across parts of six Upper Peninsula counties including Alger, Schoolcraft, Luce, Chippewa, Delta and Mackinac.

The new designation is expected to make the dragonfly’s home more obvious. Property owners in the habitat will be required to craft plans to avoid destroying the dragonfly’s home when doing any work that would require a federal permit, such as permits from the Army Corps of Engineers to raise a floodplain.

Homeowners shouldn’t worry too much about the designation, said Cathy Carnes, endangered species coordinator for the Fish and Wildlife service in Wisconsin.
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Erica
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PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I chased this article down
http://www.dnr.state.mi.us/publications/pdfs/huntingwildlifehabitat/Landowners_Guide/Habitat_Mgmt/Wetland/Bogs_Fens.htm
I think parts of BBI would qualify as both bogs and fens. The article gives useful tips on how to tell what is happening to the land, what may happen in the future, and tips on how to deal with it.
Conis said he pulled some of the muck from the inland lakes and tried to grow plants in it without sucess. My husband spent most of his life around bogs and fens. He says the muck that can't grow anything can frequently be used as a preservative. I wonder if it could be added to concrete mix to increase durability?
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Kevin Gibbons
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The silt in twin lakes does grow very good My dad used to get it out in the fall and spread it on his garden and the next year he grew a lot of different veggies. I guess the area we all refer to as the garden has so much black dirt in it. It is pretty good size. But he would spread 2-3 trailer loads a year on it for years that I can remember. I just threw out the 2" pump that he use. It was a homelite pump that was about 75yr old and didn't run any more.
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Conis
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

In all fairness, The bottom composition of the Twin Lakes might be quite different than that of Thompson or Mary, which are the two lakes I have taken the time to study a little. Thompson seems to be mostly a brown clay silt. Mary has quite a lot more gravel. One thing for sure is the lakes look to be down by a foot or so (muck up a foot). Been a dry summer.

I dug out my pond/lake test kit. Tests for O2, nutrients, ammonia, PH and all the water quality basics. Half Of the kit is missing, whats left is 10 years old. I need to spring $50 and order a new one.

The I need to get out there in a canoe and take water and bottom samples from each lake in several spots. Those tests would pretty well tell where each lake is at. These are the same tests that would be done professionally for $500 including an "written intrepretation". The same intrepretation is free on line just by entering in the numbers.

I don't know what the road dust solution is. It is pretty bad, especially the east end. Road is bone dry and baking in the sun. Feel sorry for those down wind -lakeside with the perpetual cloud in the air. Cant be healthy breathing that stuff 24/7. Gets inside through open windows. If there is a car or two ahead of me, I just pull over and wait rather than follow in that cloud. If you are on a 4 wheeler, better be wearing a respirator mask.

Dry summer. Dust is worse than I can ever recall.

Fine gravel might help but that would be gone when the road is graded.

Whatever is used has to be used enough to sink in and saturate down a few inches to make a packed base. If the mystery goop cost $20k for one shot, it is going to cost way more than that to put enough on to make a base. How long is the main road? 15-17 miles?W>E end?
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Conis
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Conis said he pulled some of the muck from the inland lakes and tried to grow plants in it without sucess.


Clarification:
Not exactly: What I said was there was little evidence of emergent or submerged lake weeds in the inland lakes. Indicating low nutritional value of the silt.

Also I said that I had purchased a dump load of "pond dredging" (locally, not on BBI) that was so black and rich looking, it looked like "miracle grow". I still have most of it sitting in a pile. Too acidic. Wont even grow weeds
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Familyman
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PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2006 9:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

man is part of nature
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John Elmer Engel
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PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2006 8:03 am    Post subject: Man and nature Reply with quote

Blah, blah, blah.
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